In a recent, wide-ranging interview with conservative radio host Hugh Hewett, former President Donald Trump delved deep into his relationship with former National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID) head Dr. Anthony Fauci, explaining why he never dismissed the leading infectious disease expert from his administration.
“Dr. Fauci was there. First of all, you’re not allowed. He’s civil service, and you’re not allowed to fire him,” Trump stated on Wednesday, shedding light on the intricacies of civil service positions and their protections.
A Nov 2020 Washington Post piece explained that the president of the United States could not have directly fired Fauci “mainly because he is not a political appointee.”
“As a career federal employee and director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases since 1984, Fauci is protected by federal civil service regulations that shield him from being fired or demoted for political reasons,” the report noted at the time. “The process to remove him would need to be initiated by someone in Fauci’s chain of command, such as the director of the National Institutes of Health or the health and human services secretary.”
While Dr. Fauci was a persistent presence throughout Trump’s tenure, the former president emphasized that he didn’t always follow Fauci’s advice.
“Dr. Fauci would tell me things, and I wouldn’t do them, in many cases,” Trump told Hewett.
This autonomy underscored the differences between the two, especially on key public health issues.
Highlighting these differences, Trump remarked on the shifting stances Fauci had taken, particularly on mask mandates: “The masks, you know, he was a radical no-masker. Then, he became a super radical masker.”
Trump also took the opportunity to credit himself with the decision to limit travel from China during the early days of the pandemic, suggesting Fauci’s approach would have been different: “He allowed people to leave China, go to France, go to Italy, go to the United States, and I stopped them from going to the United States, and saved hundreds of thousands of lives.”
In the interview, Trump was also quick to contrast Fauci’s role during his administration to that in President Biden’s.
“He wasn’t a big player in my administration. Dr. Fauci became a big player in the administration of Biden,” he noted.
Hugh Hewett further probed Trump on how he would respond to criticisms from figures like Governor Ron DeSantis (R) regarding his handling of the pandemic and association with Dr. Fauci.
Trump countered with, “He shut down his beaches. He shut down the entire state.”
“He had vax lines. He was vaxxing everything,” he said, indicating that DeSantis, too, had his own challenges and controversial decisions during the pandemic.
Trump also presented a defense against DeSantis’ remarks about Fauci, asserting, “I will send you after this conversation five articles about how much he loves Dr. Fauci.”
“This is Ron DeSantimonious. I do what Dr. Fauci says.”
The conversation with Hewett provided a deeper understanding of Trump’s perspective on one of the most pivotal moments in his presidency and his relationship with Dr. Anthony Fauci.
